The delights of renting (Part 1)

[amber]

I meet many people in the summer who proudly say they have left their aircon on all day so it will be lovely and cold when they return from a day out!! I think many of them just do not think so maybe more info needed in a villa rather than just a notice telling renters to turn off when they go out! They soon moan about power cuts but willing to overload the system day and night.

[Cosetta]

I also would not rent a villa - especially not an expensive villa - where the aircon was on a timer and I couldn't use it when I wanted it.  Although our electric bill was high, it averages out to an acceptable amount because some of our renters used very little aircon, others used a lot.  It's built into the price.  I find it more annoying that people don't declare what they've broken, even when it's not much money to fix it.  Just discovered yesterday that someone broke my electric mixer.  All renters swore they didn't break anything - hahahaha!  We had a good share of small damage like this over the past summer, I've decided not to accept back any of those who rented from us since I can't know who really was responsible.

[Kalkan Magic]

The eco sense air con 'timers' don't spoil anyone's enjoyment of the air con, they just turn off so long after detecting movement in the premises. It just stops people leaving it on all day which as Amber says, is surprisingly common. This doesn't serve anyone's purpose at all.

[onelove]

Kalkan's Magic, have you managed to get the eco sense pir's to work ?

[Christina]

The eco sense air con 'timers' don't spoil anyone's enjoyment of the air con, they just turn off so long after detecting movement in the premises. It just stops people leaving it on all day which as Amber says, is surprisingly common. This doesn't serve anyone's purpose at all.

I've just bought 3 of the Ecosense 4000 units to have fitted when I am next out in KK in December. There have been various discussion threads on the forum about teething problems with their installation/setting up, but I've contacted Hobbo (currently on hols in Istanbul) - who has successfully installed 5 units in his villa, and who has kindly offered to share some useful pointers on his return. I will post these tips, along with my own experiences in due course.

Even though I have had an energy saving/key fob system installed to avoid aircon being left on while guests are out, my property manager who pops round to the apartment to see my guests from time to time at their request, has lost count of the number of times she has arrived to find all guests outside round the pool, only to find that inside, all the aircon units are going full blast - often with windows and doors open. I am hoping the new sensors will cut down on this wicked waste of energy.

[Christina]

We were also asked for a whisk some years back, now we have 3 of them!  Plus the electric mixer, food chopper, many mixing bowls, pans of every size and shape ....  and this summer people used them all, the results were visible.

Cosetta's quote made me  smile, and highlights a dilemma I'm pondering on. I've had a great first season's rental of my apartment; It's already very well equipped, and I've gone out of my way to make sure guests have everything they need to enjoy their stay, including extras such as cocktail shakers, cafetieres, espresso maker, specialist cooking utensils, BBQ tools, water hammocks, beach toys, board games, DVD and music library. I know many other owners do the same. My guests have lapped it up, and there has so far been little damage. (That's if you exclude the idiot to lit and ruined an antique amber ornamental candle which was in a glass case and mounted on the wall - clearly intended for decorative purposes. Or the guest who nicked all my mosquito plug-ins and 2-pin adaptors - spoiling things for the next guests).

So as am spending more and more time there myself - especially during the winter, I have taken over many electrical items - as I love to cook. I have a slow cooker, mixer, blender, chopper, electronic scales. There is baking equipment, roasting tins, aprons and oven gloves - you get the general picture. So my dilemma is this: is it mean-spirited to keep these locked away for my own use, or do I throw caution to the wind and let guests use them too? Once of my main concerns would be that it would make extra work (and expense) for my cleaning team, as at present all the cutlery/crockery/glasses are put through the dishwasher between lets, to ensure everything is pristine for the next guests. (Although I did get a guest who complained that there was a dried on speck of coriander on the back of one of the plates.) Would it suffice to let guests know they were welcome to use the equipment, as long as they returned it to the box in clean condition ready for the next guests to use?

Do any owners with more experience have any comments/advice?

[MartynE]

A good point Christina...there's a fine line between providing sufficient equipment for guests to have a comfortable and enjoyable stay and complete overkill.

Bearing in mind that they are staying in Kalkan, where one of the main attractions is the selection of high quality restaurants, will they really need a vast range of cooking utensils?  In our experience the answer is a resounding "no". They are on holiday, not training for Masterchef

The main problem, as you suggest, is cleaning turnaround times. Cleaners simply don't have the time to do things like washing up on a changeover day and you cannot rely on guests - however nice they are - to wash up utensils to a good enough standard if they are rushing to get ready for their homeward flight on their last day! It's the same problem with barbeques...very nice to have, but who cleans the blighters? Cleaners just don't have the time (if they are doing their main job properly).

I'd suggest providing MORE than enough of the essentials, but just enough of the non-essentials and don't go over the top. Trust me, it won't affect your bookings

[DRBD]

We have some apartments infront of us that are rented out. We have noticed  the a/c units are on 24/7 whilst  the guests are in or out. We have seen the doors wide open & them guests all around the pool & still the units are churning away.  This also causes  problems with the units ,the fans start making loud noises cranking away which then disturbs us & fellow neighbours.  Just pleased sometimes we don't rent out, we shudder at what the electric bills must be. 

[MartynE]

Kalkan's Magic, have you managed to get the eco sense pir's to work ?

We have successfully used the Ecosense 2000 units (the battery operated ones) in one of our apartments this season. They worked well, with no complaints from guests.

The only problem is they only work with more recent air con units (the ones with a different "on" and "off" code). 

We are still using the key fob cut offs in the other apartments (with the usual precautions like soldering the key rings together )  and the bills seem to be roughly the same as for the Ecosense equipped one, so both seem to be effective. Hope that helps.

[Blue Lizard]

As a long time serial renter I would expect a largish villa with a large kitchen to provide more than a small apartment with a tiny kitchen.. as the price would reflect, whilst not wishing to go on "Masterchef" we do tend to cater a lot for ourselves, I don't need excessive kitchen gadgets but expect what there is to be clean and useable which has not always been the case ...We like to enjoy our meals in an air conditioned environment rather than being crammed into a small space next to strangers talking loudly with a small fire lit on the table!! if we eat out it tends to be snacks...More and more people we have met are catering for themselves many folk who are lucky enough to be in work are on the same wages as they were 2 years ago and as we all know everything else has shot up..if that means we self cater in order to go to kalkan we will as we don't mind anyway..The lady we have rented from for the past few years looks after us with a good rental rate confident that we look after her property and will return each year...we have booked again for next year .......as they say love is a two way street!

[Kalkan Magic]

Hi Onelove and MartynE - we have 3 properties and have enough ecosense units for all rooms in the three. However although they are fitted, we haven't yet had an opportunity to programme them all as we have had guests in the others when we have been in Kalkan.  We had Benli hard wire the units then programmed one which we did fine and it seemed to work well. It was a bit tricky to do and we hope to do all of the others when we are there at New Year. I did post on here to see if there was anyone who had done the programming before but most people just had the battery operated units. I may pick Hobbo's brains for some tips though before we go out again... KM

[MartynE]

KM... I found the 2000 battery units quite easy to set up but don't know about the 4000s. 

Have you tried the Ecosense remote controllers? They are really clever.

 

[onelove]

We have the hard wired 4000 models....Never ever managed to get the bloody things to work :-((((

[headroom]

We have the hard wired 4000 models....Never ever managed to get the bloody things to work :-((((

we too had the 4000's, got one wired in (by qualified electrical engineer) didn't work, couldn't reset it, sent them back, great idea but far from foolproof. The remotes sound good I watched the you tube vid. eyes glazed over a couple of times, brain switched off obviously a serious faff to set up, I reckon it would take me at least half a day to set six up. 

[onelove]

How much is your Day Rate ? !

[headroom]

How much is your Day Rate ? !

point taken.

[hobbo]

OK here goes..
Ecosense 4000mk2
the position of the ecosense is very important..
Placing it :
directly below the AC unit means that whilst it can 'see' the room and detect movement unfortunately it seems that the moving air blowing over it is detected as movement and hence doesn't switch off. 
Directly above the AC unit means that there is a 'shadow' under the unit where it will not detect movement, e.g. if the AC is above the bed the unit doesn't see the person on the bed.
Same is true if set to the right or left of the AC unit. (movement detection shadow)
I found the best location is to the right or left of the AC unit and slightly lower (e.g. top right corner of the ecosense touching the bottom left corner of the AC unit ) so it can see most of the room and is away from the moving air. The electrician we used didn't understand this and I ended up moving reconnecting them myself. As the units are mounted touching each other the cable doesn't need to be chased in.

I programmed and configured the devices myself, once you have done one the rest get easier the instructions should be read several times before you start!! it's hard enough when English is you 1st language...

Once setup they work.. however things we have noted when staying ourselves :

in a bedroom, where it is set to not switch off when its dark, works fine until it comes light at 5am and your bedroom has walls/ceiling that is an energy store (our roof bedroom has a concrete roof/ceiling that stores heat) once it becomes daylight the aircon switches off if no movement is noticed and the temp soars!! (also if you sleep-in) if you are in a deep sleep with no movement the aircon cuts off and the temp raises even in a cool room. Our curtains are light, darker curtains may be needed. I have disconnected the unit in the roof bedroom and will be installing an inverter style AC unit next spring (more economical to run).

I have also written a note to clients showing them how to use the timer that is built into our AC remote (most that I have seen have this facility), this allows them to set the AC to switch on after a period of time .. e.g. they are off out for the day at 10:00 expect to be back at 17:00 set the unit to switch on at 23c in 6.5hrs, this saves them having the 'justification' of 'I want the room cool when I get back not half an hour later!' something that I can appreciate.
hope this helps someone..

[Christina]

Re installation of the Ecosense 4000 sensors, I have now received a response from Ecosense Customer Services to the points made by Hobbo yesterday. Apologies for boring those not affected by the issue, but I am posting the Ecosense reply in full as it may be helpful to other members. Hobbo's comments in italics, Ecosense responses in bold. Personally, I don't feel any further forward. If any members have another brand of sensor that is simple to install and works well, I would be interested to know. (As the content of this post is quite lengthy and technical, I fully understand if the moderator feels the need to move this discussion to a separate thread.)

Firstly I would like to reassure you that over 25,000 Ecosense 4000', have now been successfully installed world wide, so I guess it must be expected that a small minority of installations encounter some difficulties.

Hopefully I have addressed the points raised below;

"OK here goes..
Ecosense 4000mk2
the position of the ecosense is very important..
Placing it :

The instructions do stipulate the recommend installation position, which is as he points out below.

Directly below the AC unit means that whilst it can 'see' the room and detect movement unfortunately it seems that the moving air blowing over it is detected as movement and hence doesn't switch off.

Under some circumstances this can happen, as PIR detects the movement of heat, so very cold air blowing into a hot room can create a false detections. However this is only temporary situation as the room cools, the differential between the room temp, and the temp of the air exiting the AC in not enough to register as movement    

Directly above the AC unit means that there is a 'shadow' under the unit where it will not detect movement, e.g. if the AC is above the bed the unit doesn't see the person on the bed

The sensor is not designed to detect a person in bed. PIR detects the movement of heat, and not a static person.
Same is true if set to the right or left of the AC unit. (movement detection shadow)

I found the best location is to the right or left of the AC unit and slightly lower (e.g. top right corner of the ecosense touching the bottom left corner of the AC unit ) so it can see most of the room and is away from the moving air.

This is the recommended location for the 4000

The electrician we used didn't understand this and I ended up moving reconnecting them myself. As the units are mounted touching each other the cable doesn't need to be chased in.

Correct, again as per the instructions

I programmed and configured the devices myself, once you have done one the rest get easier the instructions should be read several times before you start!! it's hard enough when English is your 1st language...

The first page of the instructions do stipulate that the instructions should be read in full before commencing installation, which is standard practice for most instructions. Most failures arise because the instructions are not followed.

Once setup they work.. however things we have noted when staying ourselves :
in a bedroom, where it is set to not switch off when its dark, works fine until it comes light at 5am and your bedroom has walls/ceiling that is an energy store (our roof bedroom has a concrete roof/ceiling that stores heat) once it becomes daylight the aircon switches off if no movement is noticed and the temp soars!! (also if you sleep-in) if you are in a deep sleep with no movement the aircon cuts off and the temp raises even in a cool room. Our curtains are light, darker curtains may be needed. I have disconnected the unit in the roof bedroom and will be installing an inverter style AC unit next spring (more economical to run).

Again the writer is correct, in that Ecosense does go back to operating when it detects light again in the morning. However the scenario used as an example does appear a little extreme, and to my knowledge this has not been brought to our attention before as an issue.   

I have also written a note to clients showing them how to use the timer that is built into our AC remote (most that I have seen have this facility), this allows them to set the AC to switch on after a period of time .. e.g. they are off out for the day at 10:00 expect to be back at 17:00 set the unit to switch on at 23c in 6.5hrs, this saves them having the 'justification' of 'I want the room cool when I get back not half an hour later!' something that I can appreciate.
hope this helps someone.."

I think the writer is being a little optimistic that renters will make the effort to set up timers etc. Our larger clients such as Villa Plus, James Villas, Home Away, report to us that notices and recommendation etc, are rarely successful when attempting to educate clients with regards to the use of the AC. 

Lastly Ecosense Ltd prides its self with a customer support service second to none. We provide a live chat via the web site, two help line numbers (available seven days a week), plus skype assistance (seven days a week)

[onelove]

Very helpful Chris, thanks.   But....does anyone know anyone in Kalkan who is willing to install them for us ? We will of course pay for this service.

[alantj]

During the sumer we visited Pammukale and stayed at a hotel that had found another way of limiting the waste of energy. When you opened windows or the door to the balcony the air com automatically turned off; starting up again once they were closed.   

It worked well, even my 12 year old daughter managed to grasp the concept and started closing the balcony door when she went in and out. As the hotel was in the top 5 on Tripadvisor it cannot have annoyed too many of the guests.