Mac or PC

[Vieux con]

Vieux con
Solaris! Now you''''re talking, if only it wasn''''t so expensive to put it on a normal desktop setup.

Yo Brooksie,

But surely you mean ''if only it wasn`t so expensive to get the hardware to run it on performantly?'' 

That`s one of the reasons why I want the PowerMac - initially expensive, but more bang for buck.

Single user Solaris on Intel is free from Sun - at least it was last time I looked.

Cheers,
Bob

ps This thread or another, up to you guys... What`s your idea of PC/MAC/whatever obsolescence?

As in, how long do you go on average before you upgrade your kit? I''ve had my current Dell for almost five years now, it`s getting a bit tired.


pps See that the apostropheeeee''''''s are still here! 

[Brooksie]

Vieux con
I meant initial hardware cost, not entry level stuff. But it is more than worth it. You''ve had your Dell 5 years, blimey I am amazed it''s still running

[Hummingbird]

Vieux con
I reckon I''ve replaced my PC every 3- 4 years, going back to a 486Sx in early 1980''s.... I think?

5 years for a Dell is great, it must have been at the leading when you purchased it?

I tried keeping them fresh with new motherboard, CPU, graphics etc but you end up replacing everything down to the PSU and case eventually and in hindsight you might as well have brought a shiny new PC with the latest OS and a 3 year onsite warranty by the time you''ve finished.

I''ve never worked out how some people say its cheaper building your own.  In my experience by the time you have bought all the bits retail from Scan, Ebuyer, Novatech etc you spend more because the Manufacturer is buying in bulk and charging very little to screw it all together.  Mind you I have not looked at self build recently. 

[Enjoy Kalkan]

The EK network is powered purely on Linux boxes, currently Fedora but im in the process of getting some new servers probably running RedHat.

My opinion of linux....... it can be hell ! I think the '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' say it all - I would love to work out why it keeps doing that !!

[Vieux con]

Vieux con
I reckon I''''ve replaced my PC every 3- 4 years, going back to a 486Sx in early 1980''''s.... I think?

5 years for a Dell is great, it must have been at the leading when you purchased it?

I tried keeping them fresh with new motherboard, CPU, graphics etc but you end up replacing everything down to the PSU and case eventually and in hindsight you might as well have brought a shiny new PC with the latest OS and a 3 year onsite warranty by the time you''''ve finished.

I''''ve never worked out how some people say its cheaper building your own.  In my experience by the time you have bought all the bits retail from Scan, Ebuyer, Novatech etc you spend more because the Manufacturer is buying in bulk and charging very little to screw it all together.  Mind you I have not looked at self build recently. 

Hi Abbo,
Indeed the Dell was leading edge when I bought it. As Dell have these `specials` that change every week or so, I watched their site for a couple of weeks and jumped in when the special of the week was double  RAM for free. Sorry, this is beginning to sound like an advert...

I keep the machine very clean, have partitioned the hard-drive to isolate the O/S and do most of my work on external disks, use a separate Windows lean & mean profile when I''m video editing etc etc. I looked at the self-build option, but came to the same conclusion as yourself - buying in bulk enables one to cut costs which us mere mortals can`t hope to achieve. Maybe after five years I''m just bored with it?

Truth is, I want to have another go at getting a performant (multi-apostrophee-free!  ) Linux/Unix system up, and the hardware currently hosting my Linux system is woefully inadequate.

[Hummingbird]

My current PC is 2.4Ghz quad core processor (which was good at the time!), 2mb Ram, 2x 500 GB hard drives in Raid 0 configuration with average graphics card 8600GT.

Its 15 months old and I must say its running just as well as it did on delivery.  Even start up times are just as quick.

I bought it from……….. Tesco Direct for just over £500 (excluding monitor)!

Not something I have done before but the value was fantastic and since the components were good it matters less “who” you buy it from.

What’s more its still running as well as it did on the day of delivery although I reckon much of the reason behind this is Norton 360 which as well as protecting against viruses spyware hackers etc automatically defrags the disk, cleans up the registry and generally removes “clutter”.

I wouldn’t expect this machine to last much more than 3 years but doesn’t this illustrate perfectly that PC’s are hard to beat for value against equivalent Mac’s?

[Enjoy Kalkan]

But I saw a 24" iMac in the Trafford Center today and it was very nice!

[misty]

Jon that''s what I bought for my daughter fantastic piece of kit !!! mind you I made a complete fool of myself in the i store...I looked under the counter for the tower even asked the assistant...doh

Did you know they have an inherent problem of condensation building up in the bottom right hand corner of the screen.....goes when the heat builds up.

[Brooksie]

These are the results of a recent test of Mac V PC desktop and laptop

These benchmarks are reliable indicators of performance, but the numbers feel somewhat meaningless to ordinary users. Which is why we created our own suite of tests to measure the speed of everyday tasks. We logged boot-up and shutdown times, and launch times for the Internet browser and media player built into each operating system, as well as for common applications such as Microsoft Word and Adobe Photoshop. We tested how long it took for each computer to rip a CD and install a few big software suites. The laptops were forced to play the longest movie we could find (Saving Private Ryan—2 hours, 49 minutes) until they wheezed, sputtered and shut down. Finally, we put all four computers through a stress test. We ran three video sources (a YouTube clip, a DVD and an .avi file), DivX encoding, instant messaging, Word, Adobe Acrobat and a spyware scan simultaneously—then retimed our launch of Photoshop.

The results gave us a clear winner in the performance categories, but the big surprise was how little difference we found in user preferences. Turns out, both platforms are capable and easy to use, but only one was the victor.

Mac vs. PC: The Ultimate Lab Test for New Desktops & Laptops
This computer rivalry has been elevated to a cultural divide on par with Pepsi versus Coke. Taking it beyond personal taste, PM crunches the numbers—with some surprising results (and detailed benchmark scores).

The Verdict: Apple
Mac: In both the laptop and desktop showdowns, Apple’s computers were the winners. Oddly, the big difference didn’t come in our user ratings, where we expected the famously friendly Mac interface to shine. Our respondents liked the look and feel of both operating systems but had a slight preference toward OS X. In our speed trials, however, Leopard OS trounced Vista in all-important tasks such as boot-up, shutdown and program-launch times. We even tested Vista on the Macs using Apple’s platform-switching Boot Camp software—and found that both Apple computers ran Vista faster than our PCs did.

PC: Simply put, Vista proved to be a more sluggish operating system than Leopard. Our PCs installed some software faster, but in general they were slower in our time trials. Plus, both PCs showed weaker performance on third-party benchmarks than the Macs. Our biggest surprise, however, was that PCs were not the relative bargains we expected them to be. The Asus M51sr costs the same as a MacBook, while the Gateway One actually costs $300 more than an iMac. That means for the price of the Gateway you could buy an iMac, boost its hard drive to match the Gateway’s, purchase a copy of Vista to boot—and still save $100.

[Hummingbird]

I need to go to bed Brooksie but your excerpts are hardly convincing as presented.

You are obviously quoting an old American article.

The Gateway One was an attempt at an iMac copy and doesn’t even feature on their website anymore.  The Asus M51sr Laptop is discontinued.

Gateway is also a failed brand, in my view   They had a shop for demo purposes off The Strand but they had to close their manufacturing plant in Dublin and also the shop about 7 or 8 years ago because they couldn’t survive in Europe.

I have just looked at Dell’s website.  You can get an XPS 430, this is not one of their  low quality systems, its 2.33GHZ Quad Core, 4MB Ram, 640 GB Hard Drive, 512KB ATI HD Graphics, 20” Monitor and DVD RW Drive.

£679 including Vat & shipping. 

Add one of their renowned 24” Monitors and a Blu Ray Reader and its still only £879 delivered.  Add a Blu Ray Rewriter and its £939.

An iMac with 2.66GHZ Dual Core, same Hard Drive and RAM, DVD RW,  real cheapo Graphics and a 24” Monitor is £1199, the next version up with a slightly faster processor is £1499.

A Mac Pro with similar spec but NO Monitor is over £2000.  This money would buy you a leading edge Dell system.

Apple value is not even in the same ball park is it? 

I am not knocking the quality of Mac’s and their special design features but clearly you are paying heavily for it.   This may be explained by the complete lack of competition in the Mac sector.  The PC market is full of Vendors competing against each other.

Respect to you guys but I can’t see it, unless my name was Sir Martin Sorrell or similar.

[Hummingbird]

This thread may have come to its natural conclusion….. unless Brooksie from the Mac camp is preparing for a late Easter push.
   
There are 2 recent articles in the impressive PC Pro which I feel is balanced with no vested interest.  They cover the benefits of Mac’s from iconic design to fantastic build quality but with average value for money.

Close to what I have been trying to say although my attempts have been far less articulate.

The Mac Pro

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/249895/apple-mac-pro.html

Verdict: A beautifully designed and commandingly powerful system that almost no one will be able to justify buying.

The Mac Book Pro

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/249598/apple-macbook-pro-17in.html

Verdict: Aside from the extraordinary screen, it''s typical Apple: impeccable design and build quality meets merely average value for money.   

[Brooksie]

Abbo
I am in Kalkan until tommorrow working on a Dell laptop but will contiue in more detail once I get back to my Mac haven. I''m sick of drinking all this tea waitng for something to happen on this poxy machine.

[poacher]

As a seasoned technological warhorse, its good to see that the same passion that one found in the BetaMax versus VHS (video tape recorders, remember them?)  is alive and kicking in the MAC v PC debate!

Top tip - look out for the coming generation of diskless (solid state memory) laptops/desktops. Mindblowing!

[misty]

Its been a along time coming I was out in San Jose many years ago with IBM working on this type of application. However I think we will be using the spinning disc for a long while yet.......if someone could defy the laws of physics and be able to further increase RMP on the disc motor then another huge leap forward would occur in computing.

[Enjoy Kalkan]

Ive fallen out with the traditional hard disc now............ my 60gig ipod now only manages to play a lovely clunking noise as the disc is clearly dead on it now 

....... dont worry I wont start an ipod vs other MP3 player thread 

[misty]

One inch disc drives will always suffer from shock and reliability problems....which is why they never took off for the Ipods, cameras, etc....

[Chucky]

Gosh, I love it when you guys talk dirty!!!!

[misty]

We could get into head slaps and sticksion........